Final Nail in Coffin: ICAP Refrain all Audit Firms in Pakistan to Employ Students of Foreign Accountancy Qualifications

In an interesting turn of events, Pakistan apex accountancy body ICAP issued a notice, dated 4th of July, reminding all audit firms in Pakistan to refrain from hiring students of foreign accountancy qualifications.  According to the letter made available to EconomyAge, Institute of Chartered Accountants of Pakistan reminded the audit firms that hiring any person as student or trainee who’s related to any foreign accountancy qualification is a violation of Section 22 of the Chartered Accountants ordinance 1961.

Immediately after the notice was made public, which shocked to students and members of Accountancy bodies in Pakistan, rumors erupted about the authenticity and validity of this notice as many individuals on social media considered this letter as a fake document. Though, EconomyAge was able to get this notice confirmed from multiple industry professionals.

Language Used in ICAP Notice

ICAP has some tough words,apparently to make it clear to audit firms that hiring students of foreign accountancy qualification will be equivalent to assisting or aiding the violation of Section 22 of Ordinance. In other words, forget your license if you are planning not to comply.

In one para (Produced Below), ICAP considered foreign qualifications as an ‘Encroachment’ in the mandate of institute provided to them by the Govt of Pakistan:

“The identity, qualification and regulatory status of the Institute are protected under the Ordinance, particulary, section 22 of the ordinance prohibits any person to encroach in the mandate of the institute.” “Engaging any person as student or trainee pursuing a qualification  or membership of an accounting body which uses a name the deceives or is likely to deceive the public, awards any certificate or bestow any designation which indicates attainment of any qualification possessed by a person by virtue of his being a member of the Institute or seeks to regulate the profession of Chartered Accountants, tantamounts to assisting or aiding the violation of Section 22 of Ordinance.

ICAP also asked the Chartered Accountants’ firms and members to not to assist or aid any person or Accounting body to carry out its operations in Pakistan which is a contravention of Section 22 of Ordinance. All the members of ICAP were advised to refrain engaging trainees of foreign institute of chartered accountants and also asked them to provide current status of trainees of other accounting bodies already working in firms within next 30 days of the notice.

Who are these Foreign Qualification and Bodies

Well those who are already in Accountancy qualification need no further explanation about who are these Foreign Accounting Bodies. For those who are not, following are the renowned foreign accounting bodies working in Pakistan.

  1. Association of Chartered Certified Accountants (ACCA)
  2. Chartered Institute of Management Accountants (CIMA)
  3. Institute of Chartered Accountant of England and Wales (ICAEW)

Out of these three, ACCA has the highest stakes in number of students and members in Pakistan, followed by CIMA and ICAEW, respectively. ACCA and CIMA both are working with their operations offices and staff for 10 and 5 years respectively and ICAEW is working through its representatives in Karachi and Lahore working voluntarily.

On social media, the real protest and anger was expressed by ACCA students and members who termed this notice as, ‘ICAP’s Nuclear War’, ‘Drone strike on ACCA’, and even ‘Insecure ICAP’. ”

While everyone has the right to express themselves but the truth is that ICAP is the body who has been entrusted with the responsibility to regulate and govern accountancy profession in Pakistan”, told us an ICAP member who is close to the situation, on condition of anonymity,
“There is nothing unethical with the decision. The question of ethics should be raised with these bodies especially ACCA”, he added.

Rumor Mill

ICAP’s notice did not mention names of any organization and this notice wasn’t uploaded at the time of this article which is allowing more and more people to comment and add to the prevailing uncertainty about the possible fallout of this decision.

People are now asking questions if ACCA, ICAEW and CIMA are working illegally in Pakistan? And if yes then why they have been allowed to work so openly for last so many years? There are fears as what would happen to the ACCA and CIMA students who are still in middle of their studies? Especially, there are serious concerns expressed  by ACCA affiliates in numerous email sent to  EconomyAge, who are all working in audit firms, about their future?

On social media – this notice is termed as the final nail in coffin of these bodies who have been facing tough time in front of ICAP’s policies.

Almost an year ago, ICAP reduced exemption for students of these qualifications. There are now speculations on social media that this notice will virtually eliminate these bodies from Pakistan.

Behind the Doors

Our team tried to utilize our inside connections to explore as what would happen next and what exactly is going on inside discussion rooms of these bodies.

According to a very reliable source, the decision to draft and issue this notice was made very quickly by ICAP’s council members and there wasn’t much objection within them. Given that there wasn’t much objections between them, it clearly indicates more stringent policies coming from ICAP in future.

Another of our source inside ACCA told us that this notice was being discussed by ACCA council members last night in Karachi and everyone expressed their serious concern.

“It was more like a shock session than discussion. ACCA is still working on a proper response to this situation”, told us another source close to ACCA Pakistan.

Official Responses from Accounting Bodies

We tried to contact every major stakeholder effected by this decision. Given that its Saturday and we cannot get much out from them.

CIMA’s country head, Javaria Hassan, promised to give her official response till Monday. Its worth mentioning here that Audit firms comprises 40% of CIMA approved employers in Pakistan.

The relevant person at ICAP was not on seat and we cannot get their official comment on the notice circulated widely on social media.

ACCA offices are closed on Saturdays and it was hard for us to get a detailed official version although ACCA Pakistan’ official confirmed us that the matter has been brought to their attention and they are looking into the situation”.

Given that its weekend, its hard for us to present the official stance of these organizations and Audit firms and to assess the possible fallout but our team is working on it and we’re all waiting for Monday with our fingers crossed.

EconomyAge is closely watching the development and we will keep you updated with any further development.

Following is the notice issued by ICAP to Practicing firms:


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212 Responses to Final Nail in Coffin: ICAP Refrain all Audit Firms in Pakistan to Employ Students of Foreign Accountancy Qualifications

  1. Paras kumar says:

    Not surprised by ICAP’s act, they have always been insecure of ACCA since long, where since 2002 to 2005 ACCA used to considered as a Foreign Qualification and they were paid by these Big four (now pig firms) around 12000 per month on a training contract and at the same time Rs.2500 to ICAP trainees. Now that they are scared they have been demoralizing ACCA since 2005. I wish ACCA+ICAEW+CIMA also cancel any MOU with ICAP and bash CAs in their countries. SHAME ON ICAP

    • faizan says:

      well said paras

    • M Waqar Aslam says:

      Totally agreed with you Paras.
      ICAP is feelng insecure of ACCAs thats y taking bullshit decisions.
      Last year it reduced the exemption for ACCAs n now this thing.
      Shame on ICAP.
      ICAP dont have the guts to face the competition.
      It just want to create its monopoly without competitiion.

      • Ahsan says:

        Hi,

        Although I am a CA from ICAP but i have no harm in saying that I totally agree with you guys. ICAP has been taking stupid decisions which are not only destroying its image but also creating a lot of difficulties for CA working abroad where ACCA’s are equally competing CA’s.

        Regards,

        • Faisal Rahman says:

          Absolutely Agree with you sir this controversial decision will create problem for CA’s in abroad as they are Creating for the forigen bodies.
          (tit for tat)

      • Obaid says:

        Public accounting is a monopoly everywhere. In USA you need CPA, in Canada and Australia their own CA qualification. It’s regulated profession. ICAP is always going to have the upper hand. ICAP can even stop ACCA from conducting exams.

    • Abbasi says:

      YA ur rite ICAP alwayz feel insecure from ACCA,i thk this decision is solely made to satisfy one of the big 4.Wht about the students ????? very bad and highly unprofessional decision.

    • Vishal Khatri says:

      Agreed.

    • Obaid says:

      Is there any MOU between ACCA/CIMA & ICAP? ICAEW is not that much affected by this notification. So, calm down. Nothing is going to happen.

    • ARSLAN KHALID says:

      icap intentionally creat rumors to deframe ACCA specially…

    • SRIKUMAR says:

      Look at ICAI, peer group in India.Try to take our constructive ideologies.

    • Farhan says:

      Sham on ICAP’S professional jealousy,

      and even if they have to bring such rule they should give reasonable time so that at least those who have started international qualifications can finish it.

    • sania says:

      Icai not allowed acca in india.icap allow, then shame on whom?Acca stu do free training , then how ca stu do there article.And in every country u need their own degree to do article,theen what wrong with icap decision.its decision is absolutely right.

    • xaanish insha khan says:

      Assalam o alikom dosto!! bhayo bat aysi ha k CA na jo kia vo is manner ma nahi kar na chaye ha tha, atleast 3,4 sal ka time dayna chaye hay tha, ya phir 30% quota rakh daytay merit based…ma khud ACCA ka student hu…lakin bhai ak baat ghorr talab hay…shaid ap logo k ilm ma na ho..k recently HND-HDA k nam say degree shuru huie ha…jis ko karnay k bad ACCA apko 6 exemption dayta ha…yakeen karay may aysay students or institutes ko jannta hu jo totaly cheating karay k papers pass kar watay ha…agar CA ko sirf apni parii hoti to 15% percent pass ratio na hota….lakin ACCA walo k sath aysa nahi karna chaye ha..tha atleast inrolled students k sath…to in ko chaye ha k hamara bhi kuch karay…cuz HAM TO PAKISTANI HA….

      • Muhammad Javaid says:

        Javaid…………….
        Shukar hai bhai ap ne inform kr dia nh tu hamin tu kch pata bh nh tha………….THanks Brother……………..

  2. Paras kumar says:

    big

  3. Kanwal Raza says:

    what the hell is going on yar?????

  4. Kanwal Raza says:

    why ACCA is not doing anything????

  5. Confuse says:

    ICAP should not do this. They are playing with the future of their own nation

    • Obaid says:

      They have to worry about their members. The nation should have thought twice before going for the short-cut. All those who are currently in the ACCA pipeline should have considered that things could change: I am sure they have thought you scenario analysis. Try to apply it everywhere :p

  6. Rational Mind says:

    @Paras

    What MoU? I don’t think there is any with ACCA and CIMA. Not sure about ICAEW. I though ICAEW training was given through ICAP? ?

    I would agree with the Author. If it was illegal, why would Government of Pakistan register these firms and their representative office in first place.

    Look at India, Bangladesh, Australia, Singapore, UK and etc.. similar mandate was given to their Chartered Accountant institutes. The ethicality of this issue is clear. In this country, those with power entail moral and ethical code of the industry and public.

    In my opinion, this means War. ACCA, CIMA and ICAEW should file antitrust lawsuit against ICAP once and for all. Demand equal and just rights including those for exemptions and etc.

    • Yaseen Habib says:

      is it possible?? ICAP is making all the rules and regulating accountancy qualification.

      • Rational Mind says:

        Well I don’t see why not.

        Who here has seen ACCA, CIMA or ICAEW regulating the chartered accountancy or whatever bullshit was written in that letter?

        anti-competitive lawsuits can be filed against government authority as well.. and ICAP doesn’t make any Laws.. Legislature do..

        • mr ACCA says:

          if ur in ACCA and if u have given f4, you would have been familiar with the term “delegated legislation” :) govt of pakistan had delegated these authorities to ICAP :)

        • Shabir says:

          @ Rational Mind,

          Do you even know the purpose of ICAP and/or anything relating to Chartered Accountancy Ordinance?

          Go and get some information

      • ACA - Pakistan says:

        As per the CA Ordinance, ICAP is the sole regulator of accountancy profession in Pakistan. Proud to be Pakistani !

    • Khan says:

      ICAP‬ Nailed it, they should have done this years ago before.

      ACCA‬ Ruined the job market but Its never too late

      • Paras kumar says:

        Workaround to STUPID policy for ACCA’s is to start MBA – Finance with ACCA and stay in firms ;-) unka baap bhi kuch nahi kar sakta phr… and qualify ACCA with MBA staying in firm… aisi ki taisi tumhari policy ki ICAP…

        Once ur done with ACCA with firm’s experience, obv top companies will prefer you ;-) (this applied, only if u wish to stay in Pakistan) :D

        What were ICAP heads thinking when they raised this stupid policy overnight? :p

        Learn from ACCA students, and think and be afraid jab yehi ACCAs members ban k aayngay tu ur finished

        • Paras kumar says:

          Even cheaper way out to break the jail of this policy, suggested by a CA friend, wont take name, might hurt professionally, is to opt PIPFA exemptions for Rs.1700 and again stay in CA firm hahaha baj gai policy ki
          hahahaha

          • Paras kumar says:

            One more thing, I have come to know the reason of ICAP’s frustration and overnight policy decision… Its freaking huge, which might end up sharing SIGNING AUTHORITY of ICAP in Pakistan and to all those who would thats not legal (IT IS THE LAW). Just wait…

          • Obaid says:

            If you have the letter carefully it says all ‘other accounting bodies’. So PIPFA strategy won’t work.

        • ahsan says:

          dream on…..

        • Well done ICAP says:

          ICAp did an excellent measue…shuld apply it retrospectively…some foreign black sheeps traied to ruin the accountancy profession, but couldnt highjack it…

      • Ahsan says:

        Khan sab,

        If your qualification & skills have worth then whatever the market condition is, you’ll get highly paid job. Don’t blame ACCA for destroying market, If it is the case then why multinational Companies in Pakistan have been posting jobs with desired qualification “ACA/ACCA/MBA”, they treat them equally qualified for higher level jobs. Further please tell me why international markets are treating CA/ACCA/CIMA equally. Are they stupid?

        • Obaid says:

          By international market you mean places who don’t have their own body? You know US will prefer CPA, Canada, UK, Australia, etc. their own CA..so you are left with that middle east and that too is saturated. So, where are you going to take your ‘global qualification’?

          • Ali says:

            I think you don’t know that most of the accountancy bodies have MRAs signed with ACCA so that means ACCA is an equivalent qualification :P so i think ACCA’s can take their global qualification where ever they want to.

      • Rauf says:

        I think its not about ruining the market. There may be other politics behind it. ACCA/CIMA/ICAEW do not provide similar exemptions that ICAP had provided so I dont see why ICAP should continue to help these organizations further their agenda.

        They should provide level playing ground to ACAs in their respective countries also.

    • Ali Ahmad says:

      It wasn’t our Question exactly if these organizations are working legally or not.

      All of the comments in this article are thoughts expressed by people of different bodies during personal conversations, email and on social media.

  7. Amit Hablani says:

    Appreciable Decission!!

    CA Students, specially Finalists, can now enjoy the best price in audit firms.

    Once again, ICAP protected interest and right of its students.

    • faizan says:

      DECISION not decission CA STUDENT LOL

    • Shahid Khalil says:

      Amit pailoo, yaha b pail dia

    • Saad says:

      @ Amit…. Bro ICAP protected interest and right of its students… the rest of the students are not students?? they have no life?? The ones here who are supporting ICAP are truly in-secure as ACCA is a total competitor… While working in KPMG Dubai and being an ACCA member, having got training in PK, I see no difference in ACCA n ICAP and I see no reason why ACCA should be kicked out of PK….

      • Shabir says:

        Dear Saad,

        First of all, if CA Students are insecure and bla bla……then why do you want to get your training under a CA in a CA Firm?

        ICAP is the regulating body of chartered accountancy in Pakistan so they have every right to make decision.

        Having said this my sympathies are with those students who are in middle of their articles and now this policy might affect their future

      • Vishal Khatri says:

        True, agreed.

      • Obaid says:

        I have been to KPMG Lower Gulf: vahan tho sb chlta hai bhai :p Kahein aur ki bat kro.

  8. Paras kumar says:

    Appreciate your work

  9. kamal Haider says:

    We are waiting for reactions by foreign qualifications.

  10. Paras kumar says:

    MoU of exemptions, No relations with this shit qualification… Jahan yehi ICAP Associates had se ziada illegal practices men involve hote hain.. who doesnt know k firms kis basis pe audit report sign karti hai yhan… agar IFAC ICAP ka audit karey tu ICAP ki band baj jaye

    • Daniyal Alvi says:

      Well the firms are subject to Internal Office Review which is more frequent, detailed and stringent than ICAP’s QPR. So there is no way that the firm can be criticised for their low quality audit work or ICAP for its lenient supervision.

    • ICAP rocks says:

      paras Kunmar sb….

      the move made by ICAP would really lift the level of accountancy profession….ACCA ruined accountancy profession by Cheap exemption policies to get the same repute as ICAP created itself since 1961…

      Do think over it

    • Obaid says:

      You think IFAC conducts audits? hahahaha

  11. Rational Mind says:

    @Amit..
    and what about the rights of other students?
    Is this the foundation of our nation? destroy the weak?

    Selection of any candidate should be based on merit and not which educational camp he belongs to. ICAP should’ve ‘stfu’ and do its job and shouldn’t have interfered in the trainee market. Instead of equipping their own students to compete with that of foreign qualifications, good job.

    To top it all of, our own “Islamic” Republic of Pakistan’s Government mandated institution is ‘promoting’ such ridiculous acts. Mashaa Allah, truly islamic indeed.

    • Daniyal Alvi says:

      well 2 things……
      1st of all ICAP students are equipped with competing with other bodies’ students through their education and training and there is no need to work with them in audit firms with other qualification students to do that.

      2ndly…. Remember… Its CHARTERED ACCOUNTANT firms registered with ICAP…… So whats the fuss about? Create ACCA firms and get them registered with ACCA Global and do your training their!

      • Rational Mind says:

        @Daniyal..

        I have no idea what you said in your first paragraph…

        Brother, ACCA has their own training stream in these firms.. If that’s the case, ICAP should bar MBA, B.Com, ICMA and other candidates from training as well.

        • Daniyal Alvi says:

          They all can train in the firms only if they join CA.
          Only the starting route is different otherwise a person must be registered with ICAP to get training at CA Firms.

          • Ali says:

            I think you need to do alot of research before you can just claim that there are no ACCA registered forms in Pakistan because there are many but as the regulatory authority is ICAP these forms might lose there registration with ICAP, so its a matter of choice for the firms now if they choose ACCA they lose ICAP and if they choose ICAP they lose ACCA. And if your so well equipped for competing with international qualifications then what is ICAP scared of that it had to ban other Qualified Chartered Accountants from training :P

      • Vishal Khatri says:

        haha Funniest comment :P , do you know these audit firms as they are registered with ICAP, same way they are registered with ACCA ICAEW and others. Infact these foreign bodies annually checks the quality of training and gives the ranking to the employers.

        • Obaid says:

          They are licensed by ICAP: ICAP regulates (tells them who to hire, can even cancel their licenses) them while ACCA has just put them on their list of acceptable employers (it has nothing else to do). I would expect someone who is mid-way through ACCA to at least have some comprehension skills.

          • Ali says:

            I think you need to do a lot of research before you can just claim that there are no ACCA registered firms in Pakistan because there are many but as the regulatory authority is ICAP these firms might lose there registration with ICAP, so its a matter of choice for the firms now if they choose ACCA they lose ICAP and if they choose ICAP they lose ACCA. And if your so well equipped for competing with international qualifications then what is ICAP scared of that it had to ban other Qualified Chartered Accountants from training :P And no ICAP cannot tell firms who to hire and who not to, the firms have their own rules and regulations that have to be fulfilled in order to train with them. I am a representative of a similar firm so kindly refrain from spreading false information.

    • Obaid says:

      You said ICAP should do its job: regulating is its job.

      You know PwC no longer hires you: that ends your competence and merit argument.

      If some firms are hiring a few of you that’s because you are willing to work for 5,000 for 3 years while they need to pay 25,000 to those who pass ICAP modules. Obviously they would prefer cheaper stuff.

      • Ali says:

        Again you are misinforming and spreading rumors scaring people. PwC still hires ACCA affiliates but Fergusons requires you to be a member of ICAP and that is only due to this notification of ICAP because obviously ICAP members are the partners of this firm, thus the predicament.

  12. Hamed Jawad Khan says:

    jeopardising the future of ACCA Students…what kind of patriotism is this…cant they see 50000+ ACCA students who are PAKISTANI nationals…Plus other students of CIMA,ICAEW…playing with their future…lets us roll our sleeves and Drag ICAP in courts…get ready ICAP…If things dont go right for ACCAs CIMAs ICAEW ACAs…InshALLAH ICAP will face tough resistance..enough is enough…

    • Rational Mind says:

      After verification, I would advise anyone who is concerned about this news to email following organizations:

      - GAA
      - IFAC
      - UNCTAD
      - CAPA
      - SAFA
      - ICAEW (with specific reference to their MoU)
      - CICA (Canadian one, again with specific reference to their MoU)

      Cheers..

    • Obaid says:

      You can’t win such a case. India is a precedent. I would suggest pay Zardari to get a new Ordinance :p

      • Ali says:

        Justice prevails in the courts and this is simply injustice with 1,000′s of students so i guess you are wrong again brother. :P

  13. Hamed Jawad Khan says:

    jeopardising the future of ACCA Students…what kind of patriotism is this…cant they see 50000+ ACCA students who are PAKISTANI nationals…Plus other students of CIMA,ICAEW…playing with their future…lets us roll our sleeves and Drag ICAP in courts…get ready ICAP…If things dont go right for ACCAs CIMAs ICAEW ACAs…InshALLAH ICAP will face tough resistance..enough is enough…

  14. Ali Afzal says:

    1-WHY these bodies allowed to operate from last so many years

    2-WHY ICaP reduces exemption/give exemption,they accepted these qualifications

    3-WHY HEC issue notice to Acca memer equivalent to M-COM

    There should be only one valid solution strong protest at all level along with file petations in court and ask gov to for approval ..!

  15. faizi says:

    mr amit shame on ur narrow mindness as well….. now minds r never of professionals…

  16. Quratulain Gul says:

    This sh0ws the limit 0f insecurity fr0m ACCA and other qualification market and ICAP used their ending hurdle they can.

  17. WASEEM says:

    ICAP body is rubbish at all.go and do CMA(USA) http://www.imanet.org and CPA (USA) http://www.aicpa.com

    ALL ICAP Members are now going to do CPA.Shame on you ICAP Management.

  18. Paras kumar says:

    Workaround to STUPID policy for ACCA’s is to start MBA – Finance with ACCA and stay in firms unka baap bhi kuch nahi kar sakta phr… and qualify ACCA with MBA staying in firm… aisi ki taisi tumhari policy ki ICAP…

    Once ur done with ACCA with firm’s experience, obv top companies will prefer you (this applies, only if u wish to stay in Pakistan)

  19. Paras kumar says:

    Workaround to STUPID policy for ACCA’s is to start MBA – Finance with ACCA and stay in firms ;-) unka baap bhi kuch nahi kar sakta phr… and qualify ACCA with MBA staying in firm… aisi ki taisi tumhari policy ki ICAP…

    Once ur done with ACCA with firm’s experience, obv top companies will prefer you ;-) (this applied, only if u wish to stay in Pakistan) :D

  20. Paras kumar says:

    Even cheaper way out to break the jail of this policy, suggested by a CA friend, wont take name, might hurt professionally, is to opt PIPFA exemptions for Rs.1700 ;-) and again stay in CA firm hahaha baj gai policy ki

  21. Paras kumar says:

    One more thing, I have come to know the reason of ICAP’s frustration and overnight policy decision… Its freaking huge, which might end up sharing SIGNING AUTHORITY of ICAP in Pakistan and to all those who would thats not legal (IT IS THE LAW). Just wait… :D

    Go to hell ICAP

  22. kumar says:

    Where was this ACT and Law when ACCA first set It’s foot in Pakistan. What was ICAP doing back then.

    They should’nt have allowed ACCA qualification from start in Pakistan like India.

    Now its too late and instead of protecting interest of their members only they should protect the interest of all the accountancy student because these student are not foreign for god sake they are truly born Pakistani Nationals.

    Strict action needs to be taken against ICAP this time immediately

  23. ateeq says:

    All ACCA students throughout pakistan should go on strike against ICAP..

  24. Faizan Afzal says:

    I think ICAP holds every right tp protect its students. By the way ACCAs are SO SO much in quantity (just like mosquitos). It was inevitable. ACCA was usurping the rights of ICAP students; now it will be fine. And by the way i swear to ALLAH i am ACCA (Affiliate)

    • Rational Mind says:

      Brother.. I don’t think the partners sitting in Big 4 or Big 10 earning hundreds and thousands of rupees salary are stupid enough to hire an ACCA just because someone is an ACCA.. If they are, then ICAP and ACCA should fix that.

      Everywhere in the world, people are hired on the basis of their competence, skills and expertise not because someone studied from ICAP or from ACCA. Qualifications help narrow down those decisions.

      ICAP and ACCA are both members of IFAC and are instigating more or less same accounting curriculum. The idea behind reciprocal membership and what not is same. Just because ICAP can screw around with candidate’s results to ensure CA’s worth is maintained, doesn’t mean ACCA should do the same.

      • Daniyal Alvi says:

        First of all CA and ACCAs are not equal. Please remind yourself that. You people always talk about International Market…… Well i have been to International Market too and i know whats it worth their.

        Now the recruitment process…. Well Firms used to hire ACCAs because they thought they are cheaper.. but even before this notice, like some 1 year ago the Big 04 made mandatory for their trainees to get registered with ICAP for CA, though whatever qualification they are pursuing!

        • Rational Mind says:

          Daniyal.. go over the curriculum of both ACCA and CA. If ICAP is teaching you IAS 80 or IAS 90, then wow! to them. Inshaa Allah you guys will be the leaders of free world.

          I’ve been to international market as well.. quite a few of them actually. I never compared ACCA and CA in international market. I am stating the recruitment process internationally is survival of the fittest. That’s, obviously, what ICAP is trying to restrict and everybody knows why..

          • Daniyal Alvi says:

            Even before that restriction ACCAs were only 10% in Audit Firms while the number of students of ACCA surpases CA students way high. So where is the survival of the fittest in here.

            And only writing something in curriculum does not ensure that you get master of it. I have been with my ACCA friends in firms and outside the firm and i know the level of learning they get through ACCA.

        • Ali says:

          Either you have been sleeping through this whole year or your just so full of yourself that you will go to any limits just to prove that you are right and the entire whole world is wrong.ACCAs were not cheaper you have been misinformed as the trainees with any firm especially the big 4 are earning the same amount. Only AF Fergusons made it compulsory for the trainees to get registered with ICAP, not an of the others.

      • Obaid says:

        You are right bro: they are not stupid. That’s why they would prefer to pay 5,000 for 3 years instead of 6,500 for 15 months, 10,000-25,000 for the rest of 2 years. I hope you got it.

        • ahmed says:

          Even so,if one of us gets some where for 5000 for three year,then there will be some one like you who will be sitting in there home,unemployed.Besides we can do ICAEW and get training from any foreign country.

  25. Faheem says:

    This is totally a discrimination. if ICAP feels insecure and cant compete with other accounting bodies, then it could try other strategies. this can ruin many pakistan nationals lives and many careers.

    Other accounting bodies and the IFAC should take immediate action plus BIG FOUR firms those has given affiliation to local firm here in pakistan should also take appropriate action on this discriminatory decision by ICAP. Unprofessional act by a professional body.

  26. Hassan says:

    I am not much surprised that our foreign accountancy students/trainees cant interpret this letter accurately due to their animosity towards ICAP.
    ICAP has asked ONLY FIRMS and MEMBERS to refrain from inducting students/trainees of referred bodies. Such trainees/students are still able to proceed with their studies and training with other companies, as they are allowed by their respective bodies. ACCAs can even complete their training at a salon or a restaurant.

    • noor says:

      if this is the case then network firms shud also be vanished from pakistan, as they r foriegn firms working here, lyk pwc eny kpmg deolite.. they all represent foriegn standards and thoroughly follow them >>> wht wud b icap doin den ??

    • Rational Mind says:

      Refrain?

      Read the third paragraph again please.. ‘Should not’. I guess ICAP doesn’t teach people either to read between the lines or read the whole document to make an assessment.

      Yes, ACCAs can complete their training at any position dealing with the finances. In my opinion, a good industry position like internal audit, is far better than any trainee position in the firm. Instead of wasting away 1 and half years of vouching, you get hands on experience of ‘real’ work with real work ethics. If it weren’t, why would there be a significant amount of turnover in the firms themselves? Whomever I talk with in Big 4, he is always looking to move in a ‘Finance Manager’ or ‘Internal Auditor’ or ‘Financial Reporting and Internal Control’ position…

      Did you know staff posted at ACCA Pakistan office can’t register their experience against ACCA membership?

      • Hassan says:

        To save you from hard work, which you are never expected to do, quoted below is one clause from the notification that i referred in my post:
        “All chartered accountants firms as well as members are, therefore, advised to:
        a) refrain from engaging trainees of other accounting bodies, particularly trainees of foreign institutes of chartered accountants or any other accounting body of similar nature.”
        In essence and context, “refrain” here is same as “should not”, and same i meant in my post, so there wasnt any need to specifically point out “refrain”. But again, as i said in my earlier post, animosity in action.

        • Rational Mind says:

          Brother, read the whole letter and not paragraph. Secondly, even ‘refrain’ from regulator tantamount restriction. That’s why I said, read between the lines.

          • Hassan says:

            “Should not” is never used in language of law for restriction, “shall not” is the correct choice of words. Only if ACCA taught some laws to their students.
            Anyway, dunno why are you arguing with me, i never said that ICAP didnt put any restriction on firms. i clearly said that ICAP restricted firms, however, i said “ONLY FIRMS”. please revisit my post n then decide whether to argue. dont wanna waste my time with an irrational mind.

  27. maezz says:

    this is bulshit..

  28. Abdul Wajid Ishaq says:

    Do you think that banning all ICAEW members from auditing firms within pakistan is gonna effect the mou signed between them?

  29. Hamad Ur rehamn says:

    Hello guys
    What is the meaning of all this act, are they blind just want to protect the stake of their student not of the nation, cant they foresee if they act in such a childish manner the circumstances which will be raised in the future. Today they have done it because they have the monopoly in Pakitan, The UK will also do the same risking the carrier of Pakistani students who are in abroad!

  30. faizi says:

    icap go to hell….. we all hate u(even many icapians)because of ur absolute stupidity with no idea of consequances of ur actions….

  31. Haris says:

    It’s a very good decision. It’s ICAP responsibility to protect accounting profession in Pakistan.

  32. abdul rehman says:

    i am surprised by this decision i believe it is an attempt to make ACCA students leave the country….as our country doesnot require good honest and intelligent and even more competent people.
    well i believe it is a shameful act….

    • Hassan says:

      ask employers who is more competent, CA or CCA. And dont bother referring to employment opportunities because employers prefer cheaper staff.

  33. Reema Anwar says:

    ICAP has just taken a foolish step like traditional Pakistani approach……. They didn’t think about the future of huge youth’s part who have spent time, money and efforts for years……. what will be the future of ours?????????? really very disappointing… shame on stupids

    • Obaid says:

      Haha…if ICAP was so caring it wouldn’t just pass only 16% of candidates..the council is there to think about their members no the whole nation.

  34. WASEEM says:

    Bhai simple c baat hay ager ICAP main dum hay tu compete karay.yeh tu un thical hay aur keep remember k ager ICAP nay yeh kia tu ICAP puri dunia main ban ho jaye ga.ICAP kuch nahi hay ACCA,CIMA and ICAEW are bodies with huge amount of members.ICAP shows what we studpid Pakistanis are.

  35. Hassan says:

    Why cant people understand that ICAP hasnt banned ACCA/ICAEW/CIMA from Pakistan! Its only that the firms cant engage trainees of such bodies… You can always train at an MNC or other reputable local companies.

    • hussain says:

      i think icap is forgetting that these ferms are not only working in pakistan but they are working world wide and if they dont allow students of forign accountany bodies to work in there firms than this could not only effect icap but it would effect these firms all over the world as acca is not in one or two countries its giving accounting qualification to 180 countries…

      here is the important part of kpmg’s history

      The firm was established in 1870 when William Barclay Peat formed an accounting firm in London. In 1877 accountancy firm Thomson McLintock opened an office in Glasgow and in 1911 William Barclay Peat & Co. and Marwick Mitchell & Co. merged to form Peat Marwick Mitchell & Co, later known as Peat Marwick.

      as the office of this firm was opened in glasgow where acca’s office is situated, so how this firm wont allow the students of acca in their firm as a trainee or employee or as a member icap should think on these points before giving its laws… icap should make his students that much capable that they could compete acca cima and icaew with their skills

    • Rahim says:

      Well hassan, don’t ACCA students have the right to gain experience in auditing firms ? some students don’t work just to complete their experience requirement its all about the having experience which can enhance your capabilities in the career you want to pursue and i am afraid my friend on the ethical grounds this decision is wrong, what about the 5 lakhs ACCA students in Pakistan have you thought from their perspective as you seems to advocating well your view point but you and ICAP need to understand that we are Pakistani nationals and ACCA around here since many years you can’t just refrain them from entering the auditing firms like this and to mess up with their futures. Where u said about competence, i would like to add here that here is where monopolistic nature is evolving at one side CA is lacking competence in the market but has got its status being governed by ICAP which is the accounting regulation body of Pakistan and on the other hand is ACCA is a globally recognised certificate which nobody can deny both have got their own positions in the market as like in Pakistan CA is dominant enough but in overseas countries other qualifications are dominant doesnot mean you can suppress on these grounds its what ICAP needs to realize too this is not the right way to do it what message are they sending to the world ? what will be the reaction from IFAC ? have ICAP thought of it retrospectively for all of the professionals of accountancy profession as a whole ?

  36. Amad Ud D in Ali says:

    what icap is doing?????
    some time ago icap approved acca as a short route for ca butafter that it was rejected…..when acca was approved as as short route for ca then was acca not a foreign accountancy qualification?????

  37. Rai Khurram Shahzad says:

    Shame on you ICAP, This will lead to brain drain from Pakistan. This is extreme of biased approach. ICAP members abroad will face the reaction. Negative energies thrown in profession by ICAP.

  38. Shahzad says:

    This situation indicates that ICAP is under sever pressure because of increased interest in the foreign qualifications by the Pakistani Students and further more ICAP is able to give such instructions only because it has monopoly over audit in Pakistan. If members of other accountancy bodies are allowed to conduct audits in Pakistan without any restriction, ICAP can not even survive a single year and it will soon be a history.

  39. XYZ says:

    Well Done ICAP *thumbs up* .. Quality should be the top priority of accountancy profession!

  40. WASEEM says:

    Why Audit Firms are not allowed?Whats logic/reason?

    • Hassan says:

      because there isnt enough capacity in the firms to acquire CA trainees due mainly to trainees of other bodies… those trainees can complete their training requirements in other companies but CA trainees cant!

    • Fiaz Ahmad says:

      Be cool why are you guys so much worried????
      Why cant people understand that ICAP hasnt banned ACCA/ICAEW/CIMA from Pakistan! Its only that the firms cant engage trainees of such bodies… You can always train at an MNC or other reputable local companies.
      Those audit firms were always meant for CA students. A C.A firm can hire any person as an employee but not as trainne. Most of the ACCA and CIMA students were not even bother to appear in CA examinations, then why they want to get themselves register as CA trainee students

  41. Munawer Ali says:

    ACCA will bounce back on this letter definitely…

  42. Ash says:

    An excellent move by ICAP. This will enhance the quality of audit firms in Pakistan ensuring that only Professionally Qualified people are part of audit firms. Also, I believe ICAPs policy of not allowing students to sit Module E prior to 18 months experience really puts into prespective the idea that people qualifying with a professional qualification are also mentally mature and sufficiently experienced. Something lacking in ACCA! And well said @Hassan (above).

    • Hassan says:

      it can easily be seen that majority of the people here are aggrieved ones… but they have to interpret things calmly… they should also know that ICAP students cant get their training contracts out of Paksitan (with the exception of UAE) but they never made this such a gigantic issue.

  43. Muhammad Aamir Butt says:

    hmmm. interesting situation…

  44. Muhammad Aamir Butt says:

    Dear students

    No doubt it is another challeneg for the ACCA students. ICAP is since long trying to keep monoply in the market and current decision was inevitable as ICAP had no choice other than this to protect its students.

    the position of the market is really critical as ICAP students are not getting articleship in ICAP firms while ACCA students are welcomed in firms being cheap labour. ICAP’s manadatory requirement of 8500 per month stipend has made it difficult for ICAP firms to hire ICAP students.

  45. Muhammad Aamir Butt , ACA , FCCA says:

    ACCA students should not be too much worried as this is just another attempt of ICAP to check ACCA but it would not be able to do so . ACCA students and members are now in such key positions in the market that they have their own say in the market.

    Despite this notice , ICAP firms will still be hiring ACCAs as they have no choice. there are very few firms in the market who cn really afford ICAP trainees on 8500 per month. Forcing on this issue will lead to making the feasibility of running ICAP firm will be even more unviable especially for smaller firms. I think the main beneficiaries in this situation will be MBAs and ICMA students as they are local qualifications

    like every challenge there are oppurtunities as well for ACCA students and members. More and more ACCA registered firms will be emerging in the market.

    • faraz says:

      thats where you are wrong, ACCA members may be in key positions in the private sector but they have to yet to make a dent in the geovement sector jobs especially in the Ministries and departments.

    • Ahsan says:

      Butt sab, even if ACCA registered firms emerged in the market, still these firms won’t be legally eligible to conduct external audits (ICAP rules again) & their business will be much nore limited to consultancy (which is not bad actually).

  46. Vivienne says:

    My issue is simple. If ICAP is providing quality services for their students, why would they not patronize ICAP and pay in the local currency but rather go for the foreign ones and be willing to pay pounds sterling? There’s something special about the foreign ones that ICAP doesn’t have. Insecurity is killing ICAP. That’s a bogus directive! I’ll forever patronize foreign qualifications than the useless local ones who don’t know what they’re about!

  47. Syed Faraz Ahmed Jaffery says:

    I think United Kingdome government should take a notice and remove all C.A’s from The UK and world wide as if ICAP are thinking about such isolation…

    My recommendation to ICAP is to think Globally,
    Also i will say that if they hate too much such body then dont follow copy past activity in examination paper.

  48. M H Junaid says:

    This is a deliberate and a wishful decision of ACAP, were they blind that ACCA was going on and taking firm roots in Pakistan?
    Why they have taken this step now?
    This is in fact a case of dirty ego and to some extent inferiority complex, they know that there is no match with ACCA qualification thus; they adopted inexorable decision to gain and flourish their vested interests.
    I urge all students and the ACCA institutes to file petition in court against their stupid decision without wasting time otherwise, tomorrow they will issue a new decree to all concerned entities to strike out all ACCA qualified students from employments.
    Junaid M

  49. Fiaz Ahmad says:

    Be cool why are you guys so much worried????
    Why cant people understand that ICAP hasnt banned ACCA/ICAEW/CIMA from Pakistan! Its only that the firms cant engage trainees of such bodies… You can always train at an MNC or other reputable local companies.
    Those audit firms were always meant for CA students. A C.A firm can hire any person as an employee but not as trainne. Most of the ACCA and CIMA students were not even bother to appear in CA examinations, then why they want to get themselves register as CA trainee students

  50. Rizwan says:

    I personally think this is the right decision ICAP took. We all know that qualifying through ICAP is not that easy. Thats why these foreign institutions have much more number of members from Pakistan compare to ICAP members. Like all developed countries who have licencing system for professions ICAP have the authority to regulate the profession in Pakistan. This is a good question that why these bodies were allowed to operate in Pakistan. But it should also be understand that there is always a start date which cant be retroactively applied. ICAP has to protect its existance and has the right to refrain any one to stop doing some thing that is harmfull for its members or itself. ACCA people if want to practice in pakistan than need to get Pakistani certification if they want to practice abroad than get the intership also from abroad. By the way I am neither an ICAP Memeber nor ACCA member.

    • sajjad says:

      hmm fine but think if uk banned all pak studnt there what will they do. thousands of students will suffer

      • Rizwan says:

        they are not gonna expel pakistanis out.. becoz for england education is an industry. They are recruiting students from all over the world. They know pakistanis are the one who are highly willing to move outside and education is the easiest way. if they close thier doors they know pakistani students will divert to others like australia or any other country….
        after reading all of the comments I have an opinion now that this step is not taken to ban foreign students but to protect local students who are not able to get articleship from good firms because of the tough competition from these foreign bodies students.

  51. Well done ICAP says:

    Icap shuld make it efforts to get this decision enforced forthwith by audit firms within 30 days

    • Adnan says:

      Well, ICAP has taken right decision to protect local students. However, I believe it would have been better to instigate a step approach to refrain foreign accounting body students. Of course ICAP is protecting only firms, audit practice, and quality of audit so ACCA students should have MNC and private firms as a place to gain professional experience.

  52. umair says:

    wht a hell is going ??? y ICAP is playing with our future

  53. Akber Imam says:

    Dear All, i personally admire ACCA qualification and believe that its really a professional institute providing quality education world wide but i have some queries in mind,

    1. What exemptions are offered to CA Inter by ACCA institute (i.e just 3 papers)?

    2. Why ACCA students are interested in joining CA Firms in Pakistan as there is no such requirement from the institute to become a member?

    3. How ICAP could offer exemptions to ACCA qualified for the subjects of mercantile law, taxation, IT, company law, etc which they haven’t studied?

    4. CA firms in Pakistan are even unable to meet the local supply of CA students, then how could they offer place to students of other institutes?

    5. Is it possible for ICAP students to complete their articles from abroad or even in local industry?

    6. Why ACCA members are able to get master equivalence from HEC but CA Inter + Aticles are ineligible to get this opportunity?

    Regards;

  54. Usman says:

    I think even members and students of ICAP have benefited from the presence of professional bodies such as ACCA in Pakistan. ICAP’s own standards of education and training have improved because of competition from ACCA. Remember monoply leads to inefficiencies. This move by ICAP is meant to keep it’s monoply in Pakistan. ICAP utilized the same tactics against ICMAP i-e refraining them to sign audit reports and making sure that they do not have the opportunity to train and develop themselves in good firms. They acheived this with their political power in Pakistan. Even then you see many ACMAs doing very well and contributing to Pakistans economy. Many initiatives that ICAP took in recent years such as permanent retentions, case study based exams, course content etc. have been copied from ACCA. Even ICAP students benefit from ACCA books. ICAP needs to learn a lesson from such bodies and wake up to reality that world is a global village now. ICAP will not be able to evade competition. This move will even hamper Pakistan’s economy. Look at how many good ACCA’s trained and developed by these firms are working abroad. Look at their contribution to national economy. Look at the contribution of ACCAs working within Pakistan. Needless to say that training in such firms helps to develop good accountants/ auditors/ consultants/ economists. I say this because ICAP had over the years failed to produce enough members to serve industry and public practise. Living ICAP members in Pakistan are less than the number of listed companies. Imagine that. So ICAP should not take steps to weaken develoment of bodies such as ACCA. They will only damage their own reputation in entire globe and nothing else in long term.

    • Ahsan says:

      Very True. Especially the part which highlighted & reminded the truth (ICAP copying ACCA & CA students getting help from ACCA study material).

      Actually a Local Body (ICAP) can’t damage a Global Body (ACCA Global). ICAP just want to re-establish its monopoly in local market & least care about ICAP & its members/students image & resulting position in the world. If BIG4 took it seriously internationally then hundreds of ICAP students could lose secondment opportunities in BIG 4 world wide. Also it will have a serious impact on Pakistani CA’s professionals serving abroad.

  55. Salman Khan says:

    YAAR ICAP BACKFOOT PE CHALA GAYA HAI ES KO ACCA KA MUQABLA NAHE KARSAKTA HAI ENTEHAE BACKWARD INSTITUTE HAI KHUD CA WALE CA CHOR KAR ACCA KARNE ATE HAIN ES LIYE TO ICAP NE YE STEP LIYA HAI

  56. Jamal Tahsin says:

    I think All ACCA students and members should make a community,get in touch and make a cartel against this discrimination. we should protest like young doctors,some ACCA seniors working in firms should boycott the firms. students and members in isl, lhr and khi should make student association and tell the media, u know how much media is strong today. we should march to icap offices in isl, lhr n khi.we can use social media to make a big wall against icap. and these should not be just words, this is practical.

    • Fiaz Ahmad says:

      Be cool why are you guys so much worried????
      Why cant people understand that ICAP hasnt banned ACCA/ICAEW/CIMA from Pakistan! Its only that the firms cant engage trainees of such bodies… You can always train at an MNC or other reputable local companies.
      Those audit firms were always meant for CA students. A C.A firm can hire any person as an employee but not as trainee. Most of the ACCA and CIMA students were not even bother to appear in CA examinations, then why they want to get themselves register as CA trainee students
      This policy is aligned with the whole world(including UK) students of alien bodies cant register themselves as trainees. so whats wrong with the decision?

  57. Wasim Akram says:

    Don’t worry. nothing wrong is gonna happen…….. icap only advised to refrain……… not ordered to stop hiring,,, CA firms and Emplyers even want to hire ACCAs bcz of their diversified knowledge and availability at low cost….Morever! the reference given of sec 22 of CA Ordinace is about a body which mislead public with the use of similar name or prohibited deeds…. The case against ACCA is very weak….

  58. S M Shehzad says:

    This is strange.
    I recently gave gateway exam of CIMA and the examination center was ICAP.
    Probably it is to protect the CA internees as there is a lot of trouble in getting internships at good firms. However other bodies (CIMA, ACCA etc.)don’t have compulsory internship requirements so maybe this is not that big an issue after all

  59. komal qayyum says:

    icap is so insecure…first they reduced exemptions for students of these qualifications and now this..at least they should think about the students who are putting all their efforts n hard work in it…they are just trying to spoil their future…victim of INFERIORITY COMPLEX…

  60. Junaid says:

    we could all say atleast being a government body ICAP,is consistent in bullying ACCA’s,but at least we should keep in mind that internationally ACCA is equivalent to CA ,even better than ca,its true that accas can train in industry ,as well as firms ,if C.As can’t train in industry ,and if icap is not intentionally screwing ACCAs than they should allow CAs to train in industry too, tht is a competitive policy,

    Currently it’s obvious ICAP is scared to hell,and if policy goes through ,C.As shuld put this in mind,they industry then will be full acca,cima andeven icawe std ,just think wht would happen to C.As if they can’t fnd jobs in industry,due to recent enemity they just glt with all foreign qulifs.
    Apni gali main to kutta bhi sher hota hai,best describes icap.

  61. Muhammad Amir says:

    Its not a big issue. ACCA+CIMA+ICAEW have a very lethal option to use, for example these international bodies can influence PwC, EnY international to withdraw their international affilitaion from local firms on this biasness shown by ICAP. Just a similar letter issued by PwC and EnY to local member firms will have an impact 100 times more intense than what this letter has.

    • Ahsan says:

      Agree with Muhammad Amir.

      Governing body of ICAP includes persons who have stake in audit firms also. Great rules by greater rulers…

    • Obaid says:

      You are a kid Amir. Why would they sacrifice their business for some private association?

  62. Iqra says:

    This is such an unfair decison by ICAP . Future of thousands of students is at stake . I have written an email of concern to ACCA/ IFAC . Every one else should do same.

  63. Unfortunate Student says:

    I want to see any comment from ACCA Pakistan Over here. I have seen other posts in Economyage where ACCA has commented.

    Lets Face it ACCA has given no good for students over here in Pakistan. I hardly know someone who is an ACCA and not willing to move out of the country for his career growth.

    Such a shame for ACCA GLOBAL TEAM.

    • Ahsan says:

      This is very unfortunate that u dont know that CA’s also want to move out of the country.
      Secondly such a shame for ICAP also that it could not do any thing for CA’s located outside Pakistan..

  64. Jazz Up says:

    May I please label this decision as “Satanic Verse”? ICAP has certainly disrespected the humanity, knowledge and the profession.
    Would be pleased to see the response from ACCA, CIMA and ICAEW. Some one from CIA as well as CISA should also retort. Certainly, internationally affiliated firms must respond strongly towards this subjective decision.

  65. Pingback: Pakistan ACCA » If ICAP notice was meant for ACCA – Let’s Move to Moon

  66. Abbasi says:

    Need to resolve this issue

  67. Ehamd says:

    Well,let me tell ? who is restricting ACCA ? Icap ? i think they first need to revised their exam pattern first.their students are dieng with extra worries .God sake ICAP put ur attention to make u more better to compete the world.The world(ACCA) is going to leave paper based examination and gonna adopt ED-assesment and ICAPIANS are yet studying Functional English lol.
    i’d must its a shameless act.they are actually losing their market share.otherwsie whole world knows who is efficient ICAEW or CA :P

  68. Talha says:

    Dunya kahan k kahan puhanch gae aur yahan pe abi tak yei chalra hai k ca ka upper hand hai ya foreign accounting qualification..icap pata nae kab hosh sambhlayga..
    as far as acca/cima students are concerned..they shud now move their focus to industry, which is the ultimate resort even for ca ppl. it wud be better to gain experience in a mnc/fs sector in controlling/finance/internal audit dept. times have changed. so shud the mindsets be. unlike that of icap!

  69. Ehamd says:

    Well , At that time i was in hurry..but couldnt resist myself.by the way thanks much for showing typicality.its not that formal place as u are considering it.
    Anyways pulling leg is a basic concern of typical people.keep doing this and get rewarded. :D
    Learn ethics and show some solidity by ur traits :P

  70. Noman says:

    ghareeboon ki degree dunun ACCA or CA. hahahaha. villagers ki degree

  71. Akber Imam says:

    Dear All, Training in CA Firms is “Necessity” for CA students but remember “Luxury” for ACCA’s. Just think about it

  72. Mohsin says:

    Quality My Foot ,

    If I am Running a Multi Billion $ company , then I will just Hire a Trainee because he is cheap , i have a reputation to protect .

    ACCA has been in Pakistan for over 12 years now , What Was ICAP doing then , where was the interest of its students at that time ? NOw that ICAP is threatened by ACCA Affiliates it just suddenly felt lets just Ban this qualification & play with the future of 500,000 Students out of which may be 10% will Qualify ACCA.

    What have we not paid money , or are we any less Accountants then the CA from ICAP ? No we are not all the CA’s have some sort of pride in them that they are some godly figure in Accounting & no one is better then them , Hence Resulting in this Crap.

    HEC just made ACCA equilant to masters Degree Qualification they must have lost their mind if they did that , it must me Idiots Running HEC .

    What do you think this decision will do ? It will cause a massive Brain Drain of Accountancy & Finance students from Pakistan , a Country whose Economy is already in shambles .

    Only people Happy about this decision are the ICAP fools who think now they will get more money , The Hell with the Future of other Students .

    Real Good , Gentlemen , A Round of Applause for you.

  73. umair says:

    Hi All

    I will not comment on this topic and neither will give long explanation and logics that ICAP has done right or wrong.

    I have only question,why CA students is not getting training in Big Firms even they have passed module D?
    I know many students who do not registered in Big Firms (atlest 10 Big firms) and they ultimately go in small for completing articles where there 3 years are wasted.
    Please answere guys who critisize but do not have considered this matter.

    • anil says:

      yeah thats true but i guess you are having lack of info.. A.f.ferguson completly hire CA for audit trainee they dont take ACCA, and as all audit firms of listed from ICAP, between Firm and ICAP do have some sort of agreement that certain number of CA candidate have to be hire by the firm to be listed, and so as many firm specially BIG 4 or big 10 are in leading hiring CA candidate, however only KPMG, Delloite, and specially EnY are spread in market for hiring ACCA but they do hire CA as per their term with icap….

  74. anil says:

    A complete nonesence decision by icap… i mean wtf yar, overnight decision by icap ruined career of thousand of ACCA CIMA and other overseas professional and spciall ACCA, Even i just affiliate ACCA, with affiliation CAT, about an investment of 4year (CAT and ACCA) and round about 5 to 7 lac of fees including tuition fees and icao just make it ZERO in just one overnight decision… i guess hamare politicaion kii tarah yahan pe parhe likhe jaahil log aagye hain referece laga… and Strong request to ACCA pakistan to make a lawsuit against decision and equality as in overseas, we as an ACCA affiliate and student and member are with you… please lead us….

    • Kashif says:

      Dear ! you did not pay this money to ICAP, rather in terms of economics, it could be termed as foreign remmitance out of the economy; that means you contributed towards reduction of Gross National Product (GNP) of pakistan.
      This decision is in Nation’s interest at large. Moreover, you shall ask ACCA for your Fee Refund, as they failed to negotiate a respectable place, in profession in Pakistan, with the masters of profession here…………..!

  75. Danish Habib says:

    Its all about money my friends.

    someone inside from ICAP whom i know told me that all policies are focused on “how to maximize ICAP’s fund”.They believe in order to improve ICAP should have more funds.

    Its simple.ACCA student who wish to be an audit trainee will pay arround 12000 of sum plus 750 yearly.so don’t worry my ACCA brothers just pay them and do whatever u want.

  76. Waqar says:

    ICAP‬ should have done this years ago before. i think we all expecting this kind of decision from icap. but again its too late.

  77. Strategic thinker says:

    Audit firms can say YES to Icap’s stupid act, if Icap pay audit firms the differential amount in payroll every month to hire CA trainees.

  78. sumaira says:

    ICAP’s stupid act. 1st ICAP stops other bodies working in pakistan then issue any notice. ICAP can’t do anything So dnt need to worry foreign qualified students.

  79. asad says:

    i totally agree with icap’s decision, these short cut takers do acca, when you are going for foreign qualification then also go foreign for training,, well kick by icap

    • Moon says:

      and may you be kicked with your icap crap from the world so that you can sit back here polishing the shoes of your stupid leaders. You have shown that no matter how hard you people study and how good quality(presumed) education you receive from your board, you people will maintain their sick mentality i.e do and think what is not being done and thought anywhere in the world! Pure Pakistani! And for your information the audit firms after which you people are so much desperate and for which your board have done this are also “foreign”!

  80. Fazal E Haq ACCA says:

    If CA firms in Pakistan are regulated under ICAP and ACCA students should not hire ACCA then why these pakistani freeshi frims get the affiliations of Big 4 international firms.

    BDO actually based from Germany
    KPMG & EY based UK

    Why Pakistani freeshi firms get the affiliation of these firms to get the international works.

    How these pakistani firms get in the race of international Big 4. Are they really big 4 in that case if want to break all ties from international firms

  81. IRFAN ANSARI says:

    This is very true that the number of Qualified Acca is Very high and the Job opportunities is Reducing Day by day Due to Which (in Pakistan) the Competition is very much in Finance Field.

    in My opinion, the ICAp’s Decision is good Enough because it Keeps maintain the Market Value High of The CA Students by Passing the Students at the Limited quantity.

    As, In Acca, CIMA, the Students Clear the Exams easily due to Which the Remuneration offered by the Industries is Reducing.

    Love u ICAP.

  82. Hamed Jawad Khan says:

    Majority of you would like to know the real difference between CA and ACCA Syallabus. The real problem with CA students is that they think they have the toughest syallabus in the world. Well… Lets find it out if it is really that technical as compared to ACCA syallabus. Next time any CA guy tells you that they study the most difficult syallabus and thats why they have the right to be given preference in Audit firms then just throw the following links to him :D
    One of the most interesting topic and thread found so far pointing out the differences/ similarities between CA and ACCA Syallbus. Though it will take time , but do visit the following links once free…

    Episode # 1: CA Module ‘E’ E-17 “Business Management” Vs ACCA ‘Professional Level’ P-3 “Business Analysis”.
    http://www.accountancy.com.pk/forum/topic.asp?topic_id=6144

    CA Module ‘F’ F-21 “Advanced Auditing” Vs ACCA ‘Professional Level’ P-7 “Advanced Audit & Assurance”.
    http://www.accountancy.com.pk/forum/topic.asp?topic_id=6145

    CA Module ‘F’ F-18 “Management Accounting” Vs ACCA ‘Professional Level’ P-5 “Advanced Performance Management”.
    http://www.accountancy.com.pk/forum/topic.asp?topic_id=6146

    CA Module ‘F’ F-19 “Business Finance Decisions” Vs ACCA ‘Professional Level’ P-4 “Advanced Financial Management”
    http://www.accountancy.com.pk/forum/topic.asp?topic_id=6147

    Credit goes to Muhammad Amir

    icap overproud CAs this is a real cracker for you…here is an indepth analysis of CA study/syllabus vs ACCA syllabus…if u still boast that CA SYLLABUS IS HELL OF DIFFICULT and TOUGHEST IN THE WORLD and Only the BRILLIANT OF PEOPLE ARE ONES GETTING THROUGH ALL EXAMS….then u guys have really gone nuts….U R REALLY A VICTIM OF ICAP BRAINWASHING>>>now have patience and view these comparisons…

    • IRFAN ANSARI says:

      Now if you would Read my previous Comments again so You would be Finding that I Focus on the Passing Criteria of ICAP. Means if you would Get the Number of Qualified Students of CA and ACCA in pakistan or All over the World then you would be aware about that the quantity of Qualified Candidated of ACCA is Much Higher than CA qualified Peoples.

      Another thing is that in pakistan the Jobs related to finance is reducing Day by Day with High Rate.Which Means if the Supply of Qualified People (ACCA) would continue with This Ratio and The jobs are being Reduced with the Current Ratio then The Finance Field Would Loss the Real Worth of IT.

      Now when we Talk about the ICAP, this Professional Body Passes the Students on the Basis of Market Demand which means that They Are trying to Balance the Demand And Supply Factors due to Which the Quantity of The Qualified students is less but These less people Get the High Salary which Means that they sustains the Demand and worth in the Market.

      one more thing that i am not the Student of ICAP. i am the Student of ICMAP (Institute of Cost and Management Accountants of Pakistan).

      • Jazz Up says:

        Hi Irfan, same is the case with ICMAP’s passing tactic which makes the students suffer.

        There is no question of losing worth.

    • Jazz Up says:

      Yah, ACCAs syllabus out line is good.

      Here, it’s just the passing tactic of ICAP which makes the students suffer. When the students of ICAP shift towards ACCA or CIMA they qualify the exam.

  83. saima says:

    Good decision. It’s ICAP responsibility to protect accounting profession in Pakistan.Quality should be the top priority of accountancy profession!
    ACCA has ruined the accountancy profession by Cheap exemption policies.

  84. IDITA says:

    All,
    I am not a Pakistani citizen but know well about ICAP and Other accounting bodies. Cool down,
    at least this accounting body is not selling certificates. I rank this at par with my accounting body (ICAEW). dont do comparison based on number of members as
    100 DONKEYS CAN’T BE COMPARED WITH ONE WISE MAN.

    Dont’t try to defame any professional body please

  85. Ashfaq says:

    All comments are here from ACCA’s…lol. Continue your studies and don’t interfere in the decision making process of Accountancy Bodies. Every country has there own accountancy bodies which are genuinely preparing there students in order to overcome the issues related to the the country’s own businesses. Mostly those students Which are known to me switched to ACCA when they not faced the CA. Personally I think CA is tough then ACCA and needs very hard studies.

    Regards

    • Rahim says:

      Well brother we ACCA students are Pakistani too and we have every right to protest and interfere in decisions against our intrests and well look around the world u won’t find any accountancy regulatory body having its own institute in the field here CA is governed by them so monopoly is expected as its not an independent body and well its your own perspective so can’t comment on that if u can than proof them with factual figures before drawing your conclusions. Well i doubt what ethics they teach you after taking such decision to carry forward in your future well think wisely.

  86. Pingback: Breaking: Competition Commission Seek Clarification from ICAP, ACCA and ICAEW - Economy Age

  87. ainy says:

    can any body tell me what the hell was decided at last. i am compleately freafed out

  88. sani says:

    such a nonsense decision being imposed. thats so childish and illogical. government should not have allowed foreign bodies to operate in the first place. why ruining future of its own people for sake of profitability and business of icap? shameless bastards

  89. Akhtar says:

    I ask two questions of those who are registered with these two bodies:

    1. How much foreign exchange are you spending in getting these qualifications? From the time you initially register to the time you pass the final exam?

    2. Why are you not registering in and appearing in the ICAP exams?

    • Azeem says:

      1. quite a bit because we can :)

      2. its upto us which ever qualification we shoose to pursue be it acca ca mba bba bcom :)

      3. icap lost :)

      4. enough said… lol

  90. Pingback: Pakistan ACCA » Head of ACCA Pakistan, Arif Masud Mirza, Communicate with Students on ICAP Notice

  91. Pingback: ICAP Decided to take a Stand on its Notice: Sources - Economy Age

  92. SMH says:

    Audit firms relate to ICAP, professional practice and its governance run by SECP/ICAP, country taxation and corporate matters in ICAP hand, country’s financial job market in hands of ICAP, ACCA affiliate training in any company for three years deemed sufficient for ACCA to grant membership by their own rules etc, even ACCAs cannot audit in country, then who will win and who will lose. The management of ACCA in Pakistan is seriously not concerned about resolution of all above stated matters let alone they be defending ACCA students/affiliates. It’s all a crap and ACCA should have reconciled rather than fighting. CCP is not a sole decision maker. Only in this blog can reader read about the cases where CCP has to defend its actions in courts. Nevertheless, both, ICAP and ACCA should devise a reconciliation mechanism. Students/members should understand that thousands of affiliates graduating every year only in Pakistan are actually becoming a demand/supply problem in reality. Even with no ICAP/CA in country, they will find difficulties and that is the vow of such global degrees. Even in England, ICAEW ensures the quality and demand/supply. ACCA however is concerned only about leniently passing and earning zillions of money in form of admission, registration, examination, and affiliate and membership fee. Compare membership fee paid by an ACA of 10,000 versus that of ACCA of about 30,000 PKR with an exceptionally low market employment. On avg an ACCA member is just equivalent to a LUMS/IBA grad (40/45K) versus a fresh ACA (90/100K). These are all ground realities which we all should FACE, FEEL and CONSIDER before making any decisions.

  93. IT IS VERY GOOD TO STOP ACCA IN PAKISTAN .BECUASE IT HAS DECLINE THE VALUE OF MBA.GEO MBA FINANCE

  94. MBA VALUE WILL INCREASE

  95. AHMED says:

    its not a good decision because our future is unsecure bcz of senseless decision of icap??? if they want to stop it now ,,,,,,,,,,,they should stop these rubbish things 4rm intially when foreign degrees introduced in pakistan ??????